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Well, apparently this time both the superstructure and the foundation will be up for replacement. So...there's that.
For context RE: 1987 though - I could probably find pre-1987 photos if I dig hard enough, but otherwise, are such images readily available? I was born in '85 and am not sure Id've even ever crossed this bridge prior to '87, never mind being able to remember doing so. Though for that matter, my family used to live just outside the city; we moved within the city limits in 1993.
Does anyone have a status update on this bridge? Have the remains been secured?
This article provides a great insight on the relocation process, including the "splitting" method used on trusses and girders. It makes specific mention of pin connected trusses rebuilt in this manner, such as this bridge.
I agree with your theory. Railroads were very into reusing spans that still had some life left in them. In fact, this article is a very interesting read:
I believe I have a location where this truss could have been moved to:
This is also a 140' truss (the measured distance between the east abutment on this bridge and the western pier, which appears to be a former abutment). Located Labette County, the bridge was relocated there around 1953. I've found that sometimes bridge parts could be in storage for several years. I believe there is a good change that the Salt Creek Bridge could be the original location.
Thinking about this....
Frisco used quite a few ~100-foot truss spans, and the stone pier on the west bank looks wide enough to support a truss. The 52-foot spans look older than 1951 but Frisco moved steel spans around quite a bit. Possibly the new piers and used spans were moved in to replace an old truss.
Former Frisco bridge on Carthage-Wichita line. Frisco steel bridge book says two 52-foot DPG and two 25-foot I-beams, installed in 1950. Not clear if that's the bridge or just the I-beams but the pictures look like just the I-beams.
Thanks Tony, deleted
Picture is not the Illinois Terminal bridge over Cahokia Creek/Wabash RR. It is a picture of a bridge located a little further south that crossed a creek and the original steam powered Illinois Terminal RR. Was originally the Allen electric line, built by the Alton, Granite & St Louis Electric line. Notice the bridge in the picture is a electric line bridge. This line was taken over by the East St. Louis & Suburban Electric line, reorganized as the St. Louis & Alton Electric line, and later taken over by the Illinois Traction System in the late 1920's. The Illinois Traction System, which took over the steam powered IT, reorganized, and adopted the Illinois Terminal name, abandoned this line and bridge in the early 1930's. On the attached map, taken from a 1932 USGS Edwardsville Topo map, this electric line bridge would be in the lower box where the St. Louis & Alton Electric line is shown crossing the steam powered Illinois Terminal RR. The Illinois Terminal bridge crossing Cahokia Creek/Wabash RR would be in the upper box near Bluff Junction.
Photo #8 is not of the Forder Bridge. The portals are different and this is a 3-span structure (Forder was only 2). This bridge was likely on SR 49 just North of Antwerp.
This might have been the bridge where a video was filmed showing an a-framed house smashing against it in the mudflow from Mt St Helens. There is an aerial photo I think of this bridge standing after the eruption of Mount St Helens with the ground covered in ash and people on it watching the mudflow in the river.
This bridge was essentially demolished and replaced in 1987. The entire superstructure including bascule leaves were replaced. So if they are replacing that already its a rather interesting development.
1958 topo shows Pennsylvania RR.
NOW its a swing bridge!
I cannot tell if this is anything significant, but there is an old bridge of some sort here:
It is a small bridge that crosses a tributary of Grouse Creek in Cowley County, KS.
Might actually be a Dam?
Been two years since I last visited. Still looks like it's gonna take a drink.
There is no longer any road to this bridge, gotta walk through a field. Nifty.
Just got back from a visit. Wow, no repairing this guy. Looks like it will be washed away next big flood. Thanx to Ron Enlow for the tour!!!
Thanks Mike, wasn't sure of Former RR and if open to pedestrians. Im old and it was getting late so posted what I knew. Bridge titan LUKE as often happens fixed for me.
always appreciate your assist! Sometimes Ill post and come back. All edits to make for clarity correctness etc FINE with me. If Ive really missed the boat (as I have) let me know Ill Delete and start over.
Current plans appear to be to replace this bridge with a “haunched girder bridge” that apparently will be “like the Sam Rayburn Bridge over the Clinch River”, which is also on I-40. However, as we saw with the Hulton Bridge in PA, and the Fort Stueben Bridge in WV/OH, even an “attractive” girder bridge or cable-stayed bridge, while better than an outright UCEB, still cannot replace the geometric beauty of an historic truss bridge.
Jeff: If you look at the first postcard, the roadway begins on the right side of the bridge, and end on the left side.
Since it creates an "X", they called it "Criss-Cross Bridge".
Art: Check your email.
Dana/Kay often omits RR names or status (And sometimes design) if they don't know or cannot find them.
Sometimes irksome, but understandable considering some users get themselves worked up over the minutiae instead of just changing it.
Unknown status? There's a NBI report which would seem to indicate that it's still there, the StreetView shows likewise... nothing happened to this bridge very recently, did it?
Why is this bridge named "Criss-Cross"?
Luke, link? That sounds like fun!
Per forum AKA Underwood bridge
The bridge is known as Underwood Bridge. Is there some way for you to include the name here?
Thanks in Advance!
MDOT has this scheduled for replacement. The project is scheduled to begin in 2020, and reportedly could take up to two years to complete. The West Channel bridge will not be having work done at that time.
As someone who goes over this bridge several times per WEEK as of late, oh boy will this be a headache to deal with once 2020 hits.
As per an article printed on 9-14-18 in the Reading Eagle this bridge will reopen in May of 2019,not November of 2018 as originally planned which means that this project took a year to complete,not 6 months.During excavation,crews discovered the soil would not provide the desired bearing capacity to support the footers for the new bridge.Alfred A. Picca,pennDOT assistant district executive for construction,said in a press release."This requires some additional design work,as well as having the contractor constructing subfooters to provide additional support for the bridge".This project cost nearly $2.5 million.Detours are still in place.
You are correct that Bethlehem Steel fabricated this bridge. It was done in our Leetdale PA fab shop (near Pittsburgh) I was the superintendent of this shop when it was done and have a few pictures showing the-milling set-up. We did all steps in the fabrication including the original painting. You are free to contact me but do it soon. HA I am 84 ad not getting ay younger. PS The shop closed in 1976 but I remained with Beth Steel until 1996.
I was responsible for the shop of 300 plus workers. I do a presentation concerning the many bridges that I worked on including this one. I was at the site on two occasions while it was being built.
I have never been in the casino, but I know lots who have and I'll find out if it's still there. Doubt it though.
The replicated Moose Brook (using salvaged Rods Nuts & Washers and Cast Iron Angle Blocks) is now the Trout Brook and has been emplaced at the WW&F Rw and will within the coming year carry trains again.
pipe line crossing in view on photo still extant on sat views
This bridge is a mystery bridge. Apparently there was (still is?) a bowstring pony truss located at the French Lick Casino. Anybody know anything about this one?
Just stumbled upon this one. It appears the plaque in Picture #10 would indicate this was a former railroad span. The Chicago & North Western was known to reuse these Lattice Pony Trusses as overhead bridges. The outriggers were commonly added after reconstruction. Oftentimes, the original construction was done in the early to mid 1880s, and the reconstruction done between 1895 and 1915, when the mainlines were reconstructed. Some similar bridges, in original configuration is below:
It looks like this bridge could possibly have outriggers recycled from heel bracing from a through truss. Is this possible? Certainly can see why the Chicago & North Western was known as the "Cheap & Nothing Wasted".
This is a curious one. Pictures are in the links section. Bridge appeared to have two pony trusses similar to ones recycled railroad spans used:
Any ideas on the main truss build date?
Comment is of course wrong. Bridge was there in 2011, but is gone now. Streetview has some really old and blurry views of the bridge, but the satellite view is much more current and shows it's been replaced by some boring concrete thing.
Now now, don't tease him too hard or he'll make a YouTube video about you too. :')
If I tell you, Douglas will draw it :^)
This bridge is located at 1700 Highland Ridge road,Lowell,Ohio within Washington County. I took photos of it on private property.
This bridge has been reopened.
was this a swing bridge?
I recently purchased an old photo album of postcard size photos of construction of the mulberry river bridge Franklin co.Arkansas. They have white lettering on front with info like a rppc just no postage or ink on reverse. If anyone is interested in purchasing email me. They have interesting equipment and crews at work. Some pages are written with markings for example " M-3 B-15" thanks.
Different RR shown in the same book. The 1887 Independence topo shows C&A so I'm going to have to write it off as an error in the index map.
It is my understanding that CA crown copyright applies to Government. That default CA is before 1949 for expired. Brings up interesting point. If someone travelled here Christmas 1948. bought and mailed a postcard home on us side. Then same on Canadian side. The Canadaian card is Copyright expired. Would have to be pre 1923 for US one to be positive. may be relevant for Bridgehunter 3.0.
If you go to the township 49, range 31 map of the same North West Publishing Company Atlas of Jackson County 1904, it does say Chicago and Alton crossing the Little Blue at Selsa Station.
Missouri pacific is farther north.
An error on the mapmaker's part?
I'm guessing that when the sidewalks were added the substructure was changed from stone (Dry laid stone was very uncommon in Indiana) and the deck may have been upgraded. It likely had wooden stringers to begin with. The stone substructure looked pretty rough in the older photo and was likely from the earlier wooden bridge.
It's the same bridge... The walkways were added at a later date. The date given is only a circa (guestimate) date, but I did read that there was a wooden bridge (not sure if it was covered) that didn't last very long. It's definitely a tubular arch, and although the odds-makers would say it's a WIBCo product... A Rezner would not be out of the question. Come to think of it if it's a later version of the Rezner design it would have been manufactured by WIBCo. after their purchase of the Ohio Bridge Company.
Both of these photos came from out of an old book and the resolution is pretty lousy.
The bridge was rebuilt in 1944 and the piling were driven in by Herman Baass of Baass Brothers of VICTORIA Texas.
They received the contract due to the fact that Herman Baass had a pile driving skid rig large enough to cantilever the bent spacing. The bridge was built one bent at a time and the pile driving rig was then slid forward to drive the the next set of piling.
The piling were spliced due to the overall length of pile depth approximately 90’.
There are only a few piling left that are visible.
A Baass construction & supply.
Oh - and the arch seen in the second photo _really_ does not look like it is the same bridge as the first photo.
There just isn't enough resolution... The original doesn't have great detail - but judging from the half-tone screening I found in the image it's all we've got. Unless someone can find the photo the newspaper used!
There are a lot of what appear to be lateral floor beams. More often than just at the verticals - which is odd. Having them rest on the lower chord would be a bad idea. Maybe they are just there to tie the deck together?
Regarding the top chord. I think it is round - or nearly round. The shadow line is so consistent at about half-way up that it can't be a flat sided beam. Maybe it's sort of a Phoenix type built up something.
I can see diagonals between verticals in a truss pattern. The top of some of the verticals look "forked", like maybe they are attached to both sides of the top chord.
I sure wish I could see more details!
I'm not able to see trains actually going across this bridge very often, but yesterday when I was driving over Liberty there was one at the west side approach getting ready to cross.
Mike, yes that one in Midland looks like the more common standard design what I'm used to seeing in Michigan... and a pretty good example being as it hasn't had modern railings added and also is not deteriorated. The Bay County ones definitely stand out as an interesting variation.
Being excluded from the NBI because they're too short makes sense.
I also found a bridge closer to me that'd be another example of the Fisher Road bridges you're talking about. When I went to check out the Midland County bridges last week, I took Tittabawassee Road out west, and happened to drive across such a bridge near Smiths Crossing Road. The NBI says it's a T-beam built in 1932, and I don't see a plaque on it (not on the road sides, anyway), which fits with what you've said about this bridge plan: https://email@example.com,-84.1897536,3a,60y,1...
At first, I would've thought this one was a version of the same [Bay County] bridge plan with taller railings, but if Bay County adapted what was already a standard used by the state and by several other counties, then that makes sense too.
Mike believe you to be correct. build date unknown for now.
Just to clarify, I don't think this was actually *built* in 1965 - at one point when I was trying to get the NBI data interfaced properly with this and the replacement bridge, it came back with a "reconstructed 1965" statistic on the edit screen.
Also, in the older NBI listings - 1992, 1996, 2000 - this is just listed with an unknown build date. However, if there's another info source out there that proves the 1965 build date...then nevermind what I just said.
They are unlisted because the span is under 20 foot, and thus they are excluded from the National Bridge Inventory. Seeing these shorter spans just allowed me to draw a connection to the railing design, however. It appears that what the Bay County Road Commission did with the larger bridges is basically adapt Michigan's standard plan short-span slab/t-beam railing and used it for longer steel stringer spans, and also added a county-design plaque as well. In the more common "mini-girder" style railing, note the very short span length and lack of a plaque. Many counties as well as the State Highway Department utilized these standard plan small-scale bridges. See this page where I showcased a road that had a variety of less-than-20 foot examples of this design. Note the similar railing design to Bay County but the lack of plaque. https://historicbridges.org/bridges/browser/?bridgebrowser=c...
Missed one. Prevo Road west of M-13 also has one unaccounted for: https://firstname.lastname@example.org,-83.9803024,3a,75y,7...
And that's not referring to the culvert that is closer to the highway along that same stretch, which IS accounted for here: http://bridgereports.com/1247897
The replacement bridge can be seen here: http://www.michiganwatertrails.org/location.asp?ait=av&aid=1...
Bad news, I'm afraid...
Picture of the new bridge (StreetView is not available for Lasalle Road):
As far as bridge replacement goes, I'd call this an example of, if you're set on replacing a bridge altogether, you could do far worse than what was done here.
A case in point of "worse": The Aarwood Road bridge, on that same page.
Something else I've noticed about these tiny concrete girder bridges here in Bay County is that there's at least a few of them that aren't even accounted for at all in the NBI for whatever reason.
Myers Road, at Mackinaw: https://email@example.com,-83.9946707,3a,75y,2...
Delta Road, at Two Mile: https://firstname.lastname@example.org,-83.9342576,3a,75y,31...
Three Mile Road, between Hotchkiss and Salzburg: https://email@example.com,-83.9535788,3a,75y,1...
The first two are dead-end roads, but the third is not, and that one I'm sure sees a fair amount of traffic (it's not far from Delta College). I'm not sure what to make of there not being any records for these. (I also took a few pictures of the one at Delta Road a few months ago; its plaque gives a year of 1941.)
The shadow line on the arch of the first picture makes it look like a Rezner but, I think 1880 is too late.
This bridge was demolished last winter and another is being built in its place as we speak.
If you choose "replaced" instead of "bypassed" it defaults the bridge as lost.
Van de Graaff Park has been open for several months now, with the bridge installed over a stream coming out of a lake.
A puzzle for the rail fans: The North West Publishing Company Atlas of Jackson County 1904 shows this as the Missouri Pacific.
Saw on WPVI channel 6 out of Philadelphia today that they were celebrating the 50 year anniversary of this bridge.Don't know exactly what day this bridge was opened to traffic but they put a plaque up around or on the bridge.
This bridge is near my in laws house and I drove over it a couple months back. Looks in pretty old and weathered condition but appears functional. I was actually surprised that it was not closed with the new Cloverdale Road alignment so close! Next time I will try to get some pics to upload.
Bridge at Camp
Found this photo dated August 1925
I think a lot of the confusion over the 1988 design comes from the document the 2011 construction manager, BNSF Engineer, & the Engineer from the contractor published / presented.
They refer to the 1988 Bascule as a Scherzer. At the same time they note it was Designed & Built by American Bridge.
By the way: The entire causeway is OWNED by the County of Galveston. It is leased to BNSF until 2110.
Nice find, Mike!
It's interesting how it's identical to the Crumpton Bridge.
I think those may be the spans from the Craig Bridge, which are supposedly going to be relocated.
This is a marker for the pedestrian pier that now stands where the bridge used to. It says the bridge had been built in 1911 rather than 1913 (though that could very well be wrong), but it also gives a construction date for the pier as 1989, so...best guess, the bridge was removed sometime in the 80s?
Is this tunnel still in use? My understanding is this line has been shut down by NS.
If you like Ospreys you will find LOTS of them on bridges in the Pacific Northwest, Idaho, Oregon, Washington, etc. If the nest is in use, angry Ospreys will fly around squawking while you walk on the bridge. An unfortunate side effect of the nesting is the immense amount of "droppings" that drip down the side of the bridge. Aside from possible adverse effects to the steel and paint, this can be visually unpleasant. The Armitage Bridge in Oregon had its beautiful portal bracing covered in white streaks when I was there. I know there are man-made Osprey nest towers that can be built, I wish they would build some near the bridges so they can nest in peace nearby.
According to this Northern Pacific bridge book:
The truss was built here in 1916, indicating it was likely relocated. Could it be possible that this was originally a stationary span built elsewhere in the 1880s, and moved here?
Ah! Thanks Luke. I see it there on the page where I am working with my photos. So I guess my memory isn't gone, just a bit faulty.
Here is a Street View link to three Pratt spans sitting on the ground just west of Helena MT.
Pin connected, v-laced, and looking like they are in rather good condition.
I did not see a sign suggesting this was a place that was refurbishing them. And it doesn't look like they are being scrapped - which is nice.
But it does seem to be an odd spot for them to be sitting...
I saw a number of timber suspension pedestrian bridges. This seems to be a typical example.
Karl - Thanks for the history!
I saw this bridge through the trees as I was driving west on US12 - but time and my long trailer prevented me from stopping and exploring. My research since make me really regret that I didn't try harder to get to it.
I found a stock photo here:
That, plus my memory and Douglas's drawing provided the data for the sketch I added. The sketch is probably not dimensionally accurate, but it shows the unusually construction.
According to Northern Pacific Track Charts, this bridge was built in 1927. Guessing by the trusses, this is likely a relocated structure.
The uploader can choose to make their photo the default, but AFAIK only James has the power to make any picture he wants the default.
I though I remember that there was a way to change the primary photo for a bridge. Either I have forgotten how to do it, or the method change - or it's not possible. Anyway, I'd like to change the thumbnailed photo for:
to Richard Doody's first photo.
BH Photo #420801
but I can't figure out how to do it!
I spotted this soon enough as I was driving by I didn't even have to turn around! It is a fine old span in good repair. And as a bonus - there was an osprey nesting on the span. I didn't have a lot of time but I got a few photos of the bridge and of the nest. I added the nest to Osprey Watch.
Jason, thank you for the information!
As I drove past I first though "That's a strange deck - and a rather light trestle - for a railroad." I dropped a waypoint and looked into it later and from satellite it's obvious it carries water!
I didn't have time to stop, and no time to get my camera out - so sorry that I don't have any photos.
But here is a streetview link.
Last revenue service over this bridge was around 1990, after the south end was severed the Santa Fe obtained trackage rights from Dallas on the Missouri Pacific Railroad to access their customers around Chalk Hill, there was one customer left at the south end of this line near Cockrell Hill Rd. Around 1994 scrap thieves were stealing the rail and hardware from this section of track and were arrested when an observant person noticed them removing the rail from this bridge.
It was a very tall wooden trestle and one of the support structures was in the middle of Coombs Creek Rd. so the road split around each side of it. This bridge was severely burned and partially collapsed around 1986 ending rail traffic north from Westmoreland yard. For a few more years the Santa Fe came down from Chalk Hill (via Missouri Pacific trackage rights) to service one last customer north of Cockrell Hill Rd.
The bridge still does exsist - just under water. When Tacoma power flooded the region for the dam, they just submerged it. It’s stilll mostly intact about 80 feet (depending on water level which can vary due to how water Tacoma Power lets out of the dams.
It was probably built with one due to logging/lumbering on the river. Traffic which dried up in the thirties: