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Re: Re: US66 over Meramec near St Louis
Posted August 7, 2013, by Don Morrison

Sharon;

Your posting helped me understand what Jayhawk was asking for.

Info and Photos of the highway 66 bridges that existed where the I-44 bridges over the Meramec north of Fenton are now, at

38.54392,-90.434071

I'm a little slow today. 8^p

Re: Re: US66 over Meramec near St Louis
Posted August 7, 2013, by Sharon Spear (sweetsexysharon [at] gmail [dot] com)

When I was researching the wreckage and final resting place of the Steamboat Betsy Ann, I came across the following images. There is a bridge in the background of the images that looks a great deal like the bridge at Times Beach.

These are links to images of the steamboat Betsy Ann. Her last years were spent as a floating dock on the river. The first link takes you to the main page about the ship.

http://www.cincinnativiews.net/steam_boats_2.htm

This link is an image of the ship on the river as a dock in 1946:

http://www.cincinnativiews.net/images-3/Betsy%20Ann%20as%20y...

This is an image of the her after she grounded during a drought:

http://www.cincinnativiews.net/images-3/Betsy%20Ann%20see%20...

In both images you can see the bridge in the background. We photographed the wreckage of the ship during the drought of 2012 from Emmenegger Nature Park, which is on the opposite bank from where the Betsy Ann currently rests. You can also park on Yarnell Rd. and travel down the steep bank to reach the wreckage. Obviously, the old bridge has been replaced.

I hope that helps your discussion.

Re: Re: US66 over Meramec near St Louis
Posted August 7, 2013, by Don Morrison

You are correct about two crossings on the 1935 map.

I was reading this page:

http://www.nps.gov/history/nr/travel/route66/meramec_river_u...

...and took the following sentences to say it never crossed the Meramec before the old US 66 bridge at Times Beach. Apparenty it just crossed elsewhere. So, perhaps where Old Gravois Rd ends near Fenton? At the end of Ferry street on the west side of the river?

"Route 66 initially bypassed the lower Meramec River, which late 19th-century hotel and railroad operators had made a destination for well-off area residents."

and

"Route 66 was rerouted from Gravois Road to Chippewa in southern St. Louis in 1931, requiring a Meramec River crossing. The Meramec River U.S. 66 Bridge that resulted is a 1009-foot-long 30-foot-wide steel structure, and the Bureau of Bridge engineers employed a Warren deck truss type in its design."

Re: Re: US66 over Meramec near St Louis
Posted August 7, 2013, by jayhawk

Don,

Thanks for the Times Beach info! That solves another mystery. However, US66 had to cross the Meramec twice if it crossed it once at Times Beach - since the Meramec runs south of St. Louis into the Mississippi, there would be no way for US66 to only cross it once.

Take a look at this 1935 MODOT road map: http://www.modot.org/historicmaps/documents/1935002_reduced.... - there are pretty clearly two crossings.

By the 1932 map US66 had been routed off of Manchester Road (US50, which never crosses the Meramec) onto Watson Road west of Lindbergh (I believe that Watson Road through the city was signed "City 66" at the same time). This section of highway was built to a modern four lane highway during WWII but appears to have been built as a two lane concrete highway in 1931, based on the maps.

This leads me to believe that there must have been a second bridge just north of Fenton and south of Kirkwood.

Perhaps this bridge was lost early when US66 was expanded to four lanes in the early 40's, and then the twin two lane bridges were replaced in 1972 after I-44 was widened in the area.

Posted August 7, 2013, by Clark Vance (cvance [at] dogmail [dot] com)

Looks like an old alignment of Holly Road. It might still be part of the county system even though abandoned.

Re: US66 over Meramec near St Louis
Posted August 7, 2013, by Don Morrison

My understanding is that a bridge was built in 1954 to take the eastbound traffic off of the old us66 Times beach bridge, and in 1968 a second bridge built next to it for the interstate to carry westbound traffic, then relegating the us66 bridge to local traffic only.

If that's the case, the bridges now existing are the original bridges in this area.

A photo of the I44 bridge appears to show two sets of piers, I assume one set under the old eastbound deck, and one set under the newer westbound deck.

US 66 never crossed the meramec before the old us66 bridge at Times Beach.

US66 over Meramec near St Louis
Posted August 7, 2013, by jayhawk

Does anyone have information or photos of the old bridges over the Meremec river on US66 in Fenton, MO? They would be in the same location as the current I-44 bridge, which is this deck girder:

http://uglybridges.com/1282822

That, however, was built in 1972. Prior to this, there also two spans over the river in the same location. historicaerials.com has imagery showing the bridges as far back as 1954, but unfortunately that's the earliest available . There is no obvious superstructure.

MODOT's old maps show that this routing of US66 was built in 1931 (which matches with the age of the second US66 Meremec crossing in Times Beach, now something of a celebrity in St. Louis: http://bridgehunter.com/mo/st-louis/times-beach/). The Times Beach bridge is a deck truss and given that these bridges would have been built in 1931-1932, I doubt that a girder bridge would have been used to cross a river as large as the Meramec.

Was there a second deck truss here, built at the same time as the Times Beach bridge? Any thoughts?

Posted August 7, 2013, by Ellen Chwastyk (davel1977 [at] hotmail [dot] com)

This canal bridge is due to close for either repair or replacement on August 6th, 2013. A temporary span was installed coming straight off of the bridge crossing the river to carry traffic from N.J. into Riegelsville, PA

Posted August 7, 2013, by John Marvig (johnmarvig [at] chaska [dot] net)

According to a 2002 UP track chart, line was relocated in 1918

Posted August 7, 2013, by Brad Smith (gaberdine [at] hotmail [dot] com)
Posted August 7, 2013, by Lance (thelancinator96 [at] gmail [dot] com)

I grew up in Swanton and remember when the bridge burned down. It was the year I graduated from high school. It's been a long time now and I'm not 100% sure, but I don't believe that they ever caught the people responsible for burning down the bridge. Such a shame, it was a beautiful old bridge and I walked across it many times. It was a sad day when it was lost.

Posted August 7, 2013, by Robert Elder (robertelder1 [at] gmail [dot] com)

John is probably right. Granted, this bridge looks far nicer than a modern slab, but if the 2004 date is correct, then we can be sure it is a ConSpan. At first glance, it looks like nothing special, but perhaps some locals might know about any significance that I do not.

I guess our webmaster can decide if it is worthy of being on his website.

Posted August 7, 2013, by tom

Structurally deficient is accurate, but still there after almost 100 years.

Amazing what is hidden in the tree line ignored by the average passerby.

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Posted August 6, 2013, by John Marvig (johnmarvig [at] chaska [dot] net)

College kids looking it up and voting?

Posted August 6, 2013, by Nathan Holth (form3 [at] historicbridges [dot] org)

Am I missing something? This is the 28th most voted for bridge on BridgeHunter and the average vote rating visitors have given it is about the same as that for the Golden Gate Bridge. It just looks like a modern pre-fab ConSpan style bridge to me. Construction date is listed as 2004. Is there more to this bridge than the date and photos would suggest?

Posted August 6, 2013, by Dave King (DKinghawkfan [at] hotmail [dot] com)

Yes I came across this on accident on my way home from fishing.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Anonymous

Built by C.T. Gutleben

Posted August 6, 2013, by John Marvig (johnmarvig [at] chaska [dot] net)

Bridge probably built between 1970 and 1974 assuming the line was built at the same time as the power plant.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Nels Raynor (Bachsteel [at] me [dot] com)

Bringing another back to life

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Posted August 6, 2013, by Dave King (DKinghawkfan [at] hotmail [dot] com)

I set as abandoned because the line runs to the DAEC Power Plant which hasn't had trains run to it in a very long time. Not sure if any rail cars have even been on the bridge in years.

Posted August 6, 2013, by John Marvig (johnmarvig [at] chaska [dot] net)

I'm pretty sure this bridge was once on US-16, which was the predecessor to I-90 in Minnesota, based on the fact that it was on MN-16.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_State_Highway_16

Great bridge for sure

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Coosa River railroad bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Lamb-Fish Bridge (Mississippi)
Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Lamb Fish bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Black River railroad bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photos that were here have been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Lake City bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Company Canal bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Erie Canal lift bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Kentucky Lake railroad bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Junction Bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Lift bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Golden Meadow bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Jordan Bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Joliet Railroad bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Joe Page Bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Houghton Hancock bridge drawings.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Hook Square Bridge drawing the last picture has counterweights before it's removal.

Webmaster's note: The photos that were here have been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Hood River bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photos that were here have been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Highland Avenue bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Hawthorne bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photos that were here have been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Railroad lift bridge drawing.

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Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

The first vertical lift bridge built by John Alexander Lower Waddell replaced with a Scherzer bascule bridge.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Illinois River railroad bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photos that were here have been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Gills Long Bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbidges [at] lycos [dot] com)

this bridge was replaced.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Free Bridge drawing.

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Posted August 6, 2013, by Dave King (DKinghawkfan [at] hotmail [dot] com)

I will be contacting the Road Department to find out the plan for this bridge.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Florida Avenue bridge drawing.

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Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Florence Bridge drawing.

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Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

This bridge is abandoned.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Fairview lift bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Exchange Street bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Erie Canal lift bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Erie Canal bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Elgin Joliet & Eastern Calumet River railroad bridge drawing.

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Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Duplantis Bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

De Valls Bluff bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Danziger bridge drawing.

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Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

This railroad lift bridge moved from Bridgeport Alabama the last picture drawing shows the bridge of the location.

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Posted August 6, 2013, by John Marvig (johnmarvig [at] chaska [dot] net)

Tis a shame of the closing. Beautiful Structure!

Posted August 6, 2013, by John Marvig (johnmarvig [at] chaska [dot] net)

I don't think the bridge should be a problem. I'm pretty able bodied, and I've dealt with more harsh footpaths.

The trestle approach was likely what was removed. I don't think it was a steel girder span like the others.

Cody Bridge (Arkansas)
Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Cody Bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Naheola Railroad bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Interstate Bridge drawing Southbound.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

The origanal Woodrow Wilson bascule bridge before it's replacement.

Webmaster's note: The photos that were here have been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 6, 2013, by jayhawk

Typically I like to have a photo of replacement bridges as well as originals, but if the new bridge isn't notable I think that the replacement photo should be on the old bridge's page - which is this one here: http://bridgehunter.com/ks/cherokee/999916600110361/

Posted August 5, 2013, by Van Anderson (vanisaac [at] hotmail [dot] com)

Name should probably be annotated, eg "Cowlitz River (Cora) Bridge", as this is known locally as the "Cora Bridge", and is located at the former Cora town site.

Posted August 5, 2013, by J Lance (bugo [at] hotmail [dot] com)

Why is this bridge on this site? This is the antithesis of what this site is all about.

Posted August 5, 2013, by Don Morrison

Getting down to the bank, no problem. Gravity will assist you. Getting back up will be the challenge. 8^)

Just kidding. I'm not sure how difficult it may be to get down below. The bridge crosses the upper Iowa at the south portion of the bridge. The north part actually crosses a wooded wetlands area. The trail at the northeast end I mentioned is not very well travelled, and may just be from animals climbing down.

The original Bridgehunter entry mentioned trestle approaches, but the bridge looks to be all DPG to me.

The trailhead is near the intersection of Lowell and Mather streets.

Apparently the town of Leroy names their streets after Harvard residence halls?

Or after 1990s sitcom characters?

Posted August 5, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Railroad bridge drawing Wisconsin.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 5, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

CN railroad bridge.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 5, 2013, by John Marvig (johnmarvig [at] chaska [dot] net)

Well looks like a visit on the way to Preston might be in order Friday morning! I certainly better be able to get to the bank. Lets just hope there are some good summer angles!

Re: Bridge Comment
Posted August 5, 2013, by Robert Elder

Fmiser:

Thanks for letting him know. I am enjoying these drawings, but like everybody else, I believe they should be added as photographs. That way we can use the forum for exchanging ideas.

Posted August 5, 2013, by Don Morrison

Yeah, John;

They did a really nice job on this Shooting Star Trail. There appears to be a way down to the river on the northeast corner of the bridge. I'm not sure if fishermen or animals created the trail. I couldn't follow it down because I'm on a bad ankle right now.

The kiosk has a set of pictures of bridges on the Shooting Star trail.

There is ample parking across the road from the trailhead. I should take the bike for the full trail ride sometime. It goes by the Lake Louise dam as well.

Posted August 5, 2013, by Becky Webb (web4650 [at] gmail [dot] com)

Thanks for all the compliments on the Kennedys and their covered bridges. As a great-granddaughter E.L. Kennedy, I appreciate your accolades.

Re: Bridge comment
Posted August 5, 2013, by Fmiser (fmiser [at] gmail [dot] com)

Yeah, I don't think he reads the forum... I'm not sure he reads email either. Nevertheless, I sent him another email encouraging him to use the "Upload Photos" button rather than attaching them to comments.

I do see a Douglas Butler listed as an editor now. He wasn't listed when he first started posting drawings. Progress?

Posted August 5, 2013, by Mike Boehne (mikebon088 [at] yahoo [dot] com)

This is the same bridge as the Hyacinth railroad bridge. Old MOPAC branch, now M&NA.

Bridge comment
Posted August 5, 2013, by Anonymous

I doubt he reads the forum either. I had no idea people still used Lycos...

Posted August 5, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Hastings Railroad bridge in the closed position for train traffic.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 5, 2013, by John Marvig (johnmarvig [at] chaska [dot] net)

You're kidding me! Its wonderful news to see this bridge restored!!!

I might have to check it out myself this fall! Thanks Don!

Posted August 4, 2013, by Nathan Holth (form3 [at] historicbridges [dot] org)

This is the longest pin-connected truss in Texas. I wonder how it ranks in the country?

Posted August 4, 2013, by Nathan Holth (form3 [at] historicbridges [dot] org)

If Federal Funds or Federal Agency involvement applies to this bridge project, and the bridge is eligible for the National Register as stated, Section 106 should apply.

Posted August 4, 2013, by Nathan Holth (form3 [at] historicbridges [dot] org)

Glad to finally see photos of this highly significant bridge that confirm its design.

Posted August 4, 2013, by Jeff Wieland (jjwieland [at] gmail [dot] com)

According to the Lafayette Journal & Courier, the work is proceeding and is expected to be finished in the fall.

Posted August 4, 2013, by Dot Thrailkill (dthrailkill [at] wirelesshometown [dot] com)

The county plans to take down the steel bridge. The community is against this waste of tax payer money. They plan to move it, and build another one in its place. That bridge holds alot've memories for all residents that live around there.Do you have any suggestions how we can save this bridge? It is eligible for the National Registery of Historic Places.

Bridge comment
Posted August 4, 2013, by Don Morrison

You can view Douglas' drawings here:

94273918@N06/page1/">http://www.flickr.com/photos/94273918@N06/page1/

19 pages, 1840 photos.

Or, just be patient and he'll be done posting.

In a month or four. 8^p

Posted August 3, 2013, by Clark Vance (cvance [at] dogmail [dot] com)

This bridge is being restored as part of a river walk park. There is a concert stage under the concrete approach spans.

As of 1 Aug 13 the trusses are covered while paint removal is proceeding.

http://www.cdispatch.com/news/article.asp?aid=15822&TRID=1&T...

This looks like a win for preservation and reuse of historic trusses.

Bridge comment
Posted August 3, 2013, by Anonymous

I doubt he even checks the forum.

Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Sacramento River bridge near Paintersville.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Upper Hack railroad bridge drawing.

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Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Lower Hack railroad bridge drawing.

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Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Sabine Pass Bridge drawing.

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Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Lock 26 bridge drawing.

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Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Lock 21 bridge drawing.

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Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Lock 22 bridge drawing.

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Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Illinois River railroad bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photos that were here have been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

North Halsted Street bridge drawing.

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Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Duluth lift bridge drawings.

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Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Cochrane bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photos that were here have been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Mississippi River railroad bridge drawing.

Webmaster's note: The photo that was here has been incorporated into the main site.

Posted August 3, 2013, by Douglas Butler (drawbridges [at] lycos [dot] com)

Wolf River new railroad bridge drawing.

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